On the 19th September 2014 , the Blog held a second Boundaries Debate at the Togher Community Centre in Togher at 7.30 p.m. This was a follow on from the previous meeting which proved inconclusive and a revisit was decided on by all present. The purpose of the assembly was to fine tune that which had been discussed before , taking into account ecclesiastical , political and common historical connections. Attendees present on the night were Billy O'Brien ( hosting ) , Daniel O'Riordan , Kathleen O'Keeffe , James O'Brien , Teddy O'Riordan , Eamonn Pearse ( who prepared the event in advance ) with two special guests - Alex O'Keeffe and Paul O'Keeffe ( Archaeologist ) - who contributed greatly as shall be mentioned later in the article. Appreciation is extended to Fergal Dennehy for booking the room and to the Caretaker ( name unknown ) who patiently waited until the meeting was finished at approximately 9.30. p.m.
Group photograph with special guest
Archaelogist Paul O'Keeffe ( far right )
The debate began with a brief reiteration of the previous talk with a quick recap of the various factions and borders involved. As is known factually and historically speaking , Togher as a common law entity has existed in one form or another for many Centuries. It is perhaps not accurate to suggest that Togher did not officially exist until 1977 when it became a Catholic Parish in its own right. The fact remains , that even though it had been included in the old Civil Parish of St. Finbarrs and subsequently the Roman Catholic Parish of St. Finbarrs South and in 1890 the much reduced newer St. Finbarrs West Parish a.k.a. The Lough Parish ; it has always had its own identity and was well known and accepted. Even up to 1977 , as part of the Lough Parish ( and Togher people have a deep affinity with the body of water there , with the Togher Road beginning not far from its calm shores ) locals had no problem with identification as Togher. It is perhaps more worrying that later residents from out of town would carry that particular weight on their shoulders.
Trawling through the maps with some expert help
Long before any modern Suburbs or creation of new smaller Parishes , Togher itself was conceived of as painting a very broad canvas. And this was respected without any affront. Roads leading into Togher from as far afield as Friar's Walk were spoken of as Togher , though this may have been a colloquial way of explaining that a person was journeying towards Togher. It must be understood , that the area or region was still very much an agricultural hinterland even though so close to the City and that the land was fairly sparse when it came to actual houses.
Archaelogist Paul O'Keeffe , Kathleen O'Keeffe
and Billy O'Brien
An important point was raised when looking at other Religious Faiths and their own drawing of boundaries. Of particular interest was the local Church of Ireland Parish of Frankfield , which takes in parts of Togher - Lehenagh Beg and Lehenagh More and extends right across to Douglas. Poignantly , this still does not detract from the Togher name. And of course there are other Faiths , Christian and Non-Christian which may have their own boundaries and titles. This will need further inquiry. All of this serves to remind any local historians that Religion is but one small , though important part of the story.
Daniel O'Riordan steering the
debate along nicely in his own style
The Blog decided to begin with the boundaries as understood of the present day Catholic Parish and to flesh the territory out from this starting point. The official Catholic website is vague on the actual borders offering only a summary explanation and it was to Richard Henchion's book , " The Land Of The Finest Drop " that reference had to be made. In it , only the Northern portion of the Parish is described : " From Pouladuff Road , down Edward Walsh road ( all houses fronting on to same ) across Togher Road and through Sycamore Place , then up Hazel Road and across Cherry Tree Road and down towards Birch Place and Whitebeam Road and over towards Glasheen Bridge ".
Humour was mixed with the more serious topics
Even the Catholic Diocese maps are discretionary at best and do not show the southernmost portions of the Parishes. But it can be inferred from the cartography with comparisons made with modern aerial photography that the Boundary follows the course of the Glasheen River all the way around the Townlands of Deanrock , Doughcloyne , Garranedarragh , Chetwynd and right down to Knockalisheen from where it begins as a streamlet. Knockamallavoge had been in question , but because of its landlocked nature in relation to the other Townlands of Togher ( Knockalisheen to its South and Doughcloyne to its East ) and the natural feature of the Glasheen River , it was decided that it would have been incomprehensible and illogical for the Catholic Church not to include it as such.
Togher as a Catholic Parish as shown by Diocese
The journey around the region began again at the North , starting at the Pouladuff Road from the junction with Edward Walsh Road and continued South down the thoroughfare towards Pouladuff Crossroads at the Glenmore River by Lehenagh Beg and back up towards the Airport , using the Airport Road as a marker , but realistically citing the actual fast flowing waters of Glenmore as the flanks of the Lehenaghs. Passing Farmers Cross near the entrance to the Airport and further on for a few hundred yards the boundary extends across fields , dissecting the bottom half of the runway and right across the southern end of Gortagoulane to once more meet up with Knockalisheen. Even though Ballyphehane Parish lays claim to the Airport , the actual Terminals and Hotels and the northern potion of the runway fall within Lehenagh More , which is decidedly Togher District. Of course any contentious lobbying by parties is perhaps futile and at best relative , given the recent designation of boundaries by the Catholic Church. In conclusion , all lands within the aforementioned borders are Togher Parish/District.
Of course , as already stated , the modern boundaries were only one side of a double edged sword. Of particular relevance was the portion of land immediately North of the " Parish ". This would include the entirety of Ardmanning More Townland , which today houses Earlwood Estate and the now demolished Ardmanning House and Shopping Centre ( which during the 1970s was titled as Togher S.C. ). All territory West of the Pouladuff Road in Killeenreendowney has a Togher Address - Boston Park , Ardmanning Lawn , Ardmanning Avenue , all houses fronting onto the Togher Road ( locally known as Ardmanning Hill ) and all houses fronting ( on the West side ) onto the Pouladuff Road south of the junction with Pearse Road and thence south again to Pouladuff crossroads and back up the Airport Road ( more properly the Glenmore River ).
Cork City Local Electoral Districts showing
Togher A ( white ) and Glasheen C
( parts of Togher ) and Togher A ( greyed out )
One interesting motion was offered by Paul O'Keeffe as to Clashduff Townland being considered completely a part of Togher. However , historically this particular pocket of land has been de facto split between Togher and Glasheen. Even though there is no Glasheen Parish , the region has been mapped as a Suburb in its own right from earliest times. Thus the Western portion which buffers the Glasheen Road is recognised as an entity in its own right with the Eastern portion attributed to Togher , in its recent pre - Development phase known locally as " Ardmanning " ( Togher ) taking in parcels of Killeenreendowney West , certain parts of Clashduff and of course both Ardmanning Townlands. The Catholic Parish lines drawn to delineate Togher actually acknowledged this agreed boundary , making this and Killeenreendowney West the only 2 Townlands to have an historic division , perhaps harking back to more ancient sub divisions.
Determined territory of Togher
The Blog finalised the ongoing Issue with Address snobbery in regions of Doughcloyne and readily agreed that all were within not only Togher Parish but also within Togher District. These lands are not included in the official Wilton Parish which does not stray south of the Glasheen River and all lands therein carry a Togher Address.
Religion and Addresses notwithstanding , modern Political Divisions have thrown their hat into the arena with the quirky mapping of their Local Electoral districts , which amongst others see parts of Togher labelled as Glasheen. It was agreed that these are not official or commonly understood partitions of land and serve only as administrative areas and can be dismissed out of hand.
Paul O'Keeffe gave some great insights into what could reasonably be considered Togher , both in its status as a Parish and a District and advised on Townland boundaries as well as the southerly townlands of Knocknamallavoge ( not mentioned in the "Togher Past And Present " book but was determined as already stated as being in Togher Parish ) and Knockalisheen ( which is considered as Togher ).
Final verdict being delivered on area
of operations to be studied in future
A welcome tea break followed the intense discussions which were punctuated with dry humour and indigenous patois which could only stem from Togher people. Some quick scanning duties for another project were completed and the group departed tired but more informed about the often thorny subject of lines on maps. Yet again , a rose by any other name ...
Example of An Tochar Causeway
In conclusion the idea of Togher has its roots in the ancient lands of the Ui Mhic Ceir who had their stronghold at Kilmohanoch marked for many Centuries by the Teampaleen ( Church and Graveyard ) located between Matthew Hill and Cros na Gol and the general area therein and can be argued to have existed in one form or another since the 3rd Century A.D. The fact that this vanished medieval town is no more is what makes it all the more tantalizing and is definitely something the Blog will be investigating in much greater detail next year. Terms encountered during research such as Maghy ( Plain ) and Toher Meddow are all the more intoxicating and should serve as primers for engendering more enthusiasm and gusto towards the mission of uncovering yet more of the districts misty past. It should also be pointed out that the Debate was important for a variety of reasons : One ; to actually discover the extent of the territory and Two ; to establish same for the purposes of a factually correct study area.
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